179: Ryan Culwell

On Episode 179, I'm joined by singer-songwriter Ryan Culwell. During this conversation, we talk about the Perryton, Texas native's Panhandle roots, developing a sound, style, & feel for his albums Flatlands & The Last American,  living in Nashville, recording the Nine Inch Nails song "Head Like a Hole" with Aubrie Sellers, and what's coming next for the Texas songwriter.

This episode's presenting partner is Desert Door Texas Sotol and The Blue Light Live.

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Transcript

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Thomas Mooney  0:01  
Hey y'all Welcome back to New slang music journalist Thomas Mooney. This is Episode 179, where I'm joined by one of my favorite songwriters, Ryan Colwell. And I say that wholeheartedly. There's been a lot of folks that I've written about extensively over the years, obviously folks like Turnpike troubadours, Terry Allen, flatland cavalry, but Ryan is really up there on that leaderboard as well. And I've had a few really in depth interviews and conversations with him over his records like flatlands in the last American, which I just think are prime examples of stellar songwriting and craftsmanship, the storytelling and imagery and language and style and Sonic touches, they just all complement one another seamlessly. He tells these beautiful, sometimes heart wrenching, sometimes tragic stories. And as I mentioned a few times during this conversation, I just feel really attached to a lot of these songs. Which Yeah, Ryan was in town last week. So we sat down before a show at blue light for this conversation about past records and what's to come. As far as future records go. Today's presenting partner is our pals over at Desert door, Texas SoTL. If you've been listening to new slang for really any amount of time, you'll know that desert door is one of my all time favorite premium, high quality spirits. If you haven't, or aren't sure what exactly a sotol is. I'm going to let you in on a little secret that's going to up the game on your liquor cabinet. For starters, the best reference point that I can point you to is to think about a tequila or Moscow. Do you feel that Western desert that text is ruggedness? Okay, Soto is like that, but a little bit more refined, smooth and fragrant. It intrigues the palate and offers these hints of vanilla and citrus, there's an earthiness that often sends me right back to my trans Pecos some Far West Texas roots. There's plenty to love about desert door. For me, it all starts right there. a close second is just how versatile desert door really is. You can go full highbrow and experiment with concocting a variety of cocktails that call for muddling fresh fruit sprigs of time sticks of cinnamon, it's perfect for that world. If you're a little bit more down home, if you've just rolled up sleeves up your denim Wrangler button up, it's perfect for that as well. If you're just designing something that short and sweet, it hits the mark every time does adore is genuine and authentically West Texan. It's inherently West Texan. They harvest Soto plants out in the wild and are knowledgeable conservation lists at heart. That's obviously something incredibly important to me. They shine a light on what makes West Texas special and unique and worth preserving and keeping it safe from exploitation. Right now, you can find desert door all over Texas, Colorado, Tennessee, and there's budding numbers in places like New Mexico, Arizona, California and Georgia. Best thing you can do is to check out desert door.com to find where desert door is locally. Again, that's desert door.com. If this is your first time listening to new slang, be sure to hit that subscribe button. New slang is available virtually everywhere you listen to podcast. If you're listening on Apple podcasts though, go ahead and leave one of those five star reviews. And of course new slang is about as grassroots and endeavor as they come. So telling Apollo two that goes a long way as well. A retweet or share on Facebook or Twitter. They all add up and of course that helps the podcast grow. You can go over and check out the merch store as well. That would be new slang podcast dot big cartel.com there's t shirts, shot glasses, stickers, koozies coffee mugs and much much more available over there. And of course, all the links right there. They will be in the show notes. Alright, let's get on into it. Here is Ryan Cole. Well guess like the last time I saw you was in Austin. Oh, yeah. Down at what was that? It was like on tech camp or on the UT campus cactus cafe. Yeah, there you go. I'm not very well, in depth with all the the UT stuff down there. I know. It was just like, you know, went down. I was in town. So like, you know, text you it was just one of those awesome things where you were playing there where you hadn't been over here in a long time. I don't know where the story's going other than that. Last time we talked was then was right around the time the record. No, it was like a year after the record came. Well, yeah.

Ryan Culwell  4:49  
Yeah. That was a wild trip. Then I went played all the rustics watch people eat their kaiso chicken, quail eggs, whatever they were doing. quail eggs, I think so. I don't know what they're eating.

Thomas Mooney  5:03  
Is that on the the writer?

Ryan Culwell  5:06  
I mean, we weren't eating them. I think we got fried pickles. Yeah. So lots of sundresses and quail eggs going on at the rustic, nice place. Sounds like I think they're now. It's just like a giant restaurant with a stage.

Thomas Mooney  5:22  
Yeah. All the all the lights just came on all the neons I want to be gracious to the rustic but the first.

Ryan Culwell  5:31  
They were very kind to us. And it was really nice. It's hotter than hell, San Antonio, the first one we played was we have several of them and we played them all and it was great. But the first night in San Antonio on like, a Wednesday or something, and we get done with a first song and I swear to you I've never had it's never been so dead. It was just silence. Not even like, Okay, good job. And so that's what I remember about the rescue. Yeah, quail eggs and silence. Well, I don't know, maybe they were just I don't know. I don't think it was hot and Wednesday. And they were like, Who the hell's this guy? And um, you know, and I'm playing this stuff that is like, hey,

Thomas Mooney  6:17  
you're returning to San Antonio. Soon, though. Yeah. This time with Jamie Lynn real soon. I don't know if it's gonna be this is out by the time you play. But that's all good. We'll talk about that. Obviously, Jamie, great song songwriter. I know, we've talked. Me and Jamie have talked about you before. I don't know if necessary on podcast or anything. But, you know, mutual admiration, admiration between y'all as songwriters and storytellers, storytellers. I need to anansie eight. I'm sorry. It's good.

Ryan Culwell  6:47  
I was listening to your podcast with her on the way here because I drove from Nashville straight to enroll. I was like 14 hours. So I just downloaded a bunch of podcasts and just went for it. And it was really interesting. It's cool to hear other songwriters talking about writing songs. And not you know, good songwriters talking about writing songs. It just opens your mind up a little bit. But it's crazy how intentional people can be. Right? Like, she knows what the hell she's doing. And she does it on purpose. And then she can repeat the process. And I'm out here just swinging the bat hoping I hit something.

Thomas Mooney  7:20  
See, that's, that's what's so amazing is, is how there can be these different little processes for every songwriter. where, like, I don't know how I would be as a songwriter, what my process would be, but I find it really I guess like I I go towards more the people who, like a Jamie who is writing a song and it takes her a long time to finish it because of the the craft of it and like the intention being intentional with every like Word. Yeah. Now I'm not saying I would be that good. I just felt like I would just continue fucking with it before, and they would never be done kind of thing. But yeah. Is that do you feel like that?

Ryan Culwell  8:05  
I'd say every once in a while. I say it's a temptation. I have the song. It's not out yet. But I mean, I finished it like three years ago. And then I just uprooted the whole thing. And the second half of the site has changed completely. And you know, and that's recorded. Now. It's a done deal, but I thought it was done. Nothing's done until it's committed. You know? Put it on them. Put it on tape, whatever. Yeah, well, even then. And then yeah, they I still think I change things live all the time. Well, I say all the time. I'm playing so long. Yeah, cuz we did up there.

Thomas Mooney  8:44  
I was talking with not the name drop here. But I was talking with Jimmy Dale Gilmore earlier today not to name drop. And they were one of the fascinating things with the flatlanders is how they kind of have like a shared catalogue, where they've all kind of recorded the songs individually, and then together. And then like, again, and it really shows you how a song can be like the many interpretations even just among three members, three artists.

Ryan Culwell  9:10  
Yeah, it's like a tiny little bluegrass world. You know, like bluegrass, they have like, here's the standards is 100 200 songs, what everybody knows them. Here's a tune. Here's a song and we do it like this. Well, that's just a slight variation. My grandpa showed me that you know, and it's like, they just did that amongst themselves and you just get to watch things bloom. Right, you know, I feel like the Texas used to be more like that. Maybe it's still like that. And I'm just unaware. But like, you look back and you see not just those dudes, but their cover and some other guy, you know, way down covering guy you know, my whole world was that way my my daughter's one of their favorite songs is Emmylou Harris covering got Clark's new cut road, and you're like, well, that's a whole different song now. You know, right. The world just you know, Now we're at you know, now I'm like hell, I'm playing my songs, listen to me. And so maybe it's better to spread the love.

Thomas Mooney  10:07  
I think there's more. There's something to both of those aspects though. Sure. Where I know that because i've i've tweeted about that before, like, we don't ever get any like covers. We don't have like a, you know, a song. There's not like a standard that everyone covers anymore. Or cuts like, yeah, everyone's cutting every Kristofferson song, right? There's like, 100 versions of Sunday morning coming down or something, right. And I guess like, I know, Drew Kennedy had mentioned, it's probably because now, you're only given, like, so many times to cut a record, you're saving money yourself to make a record. And then like, maybe you feel like those 10 songs like those, whatever number it is, I need, like I should I need to cut these for, to at least get them out there.

Ryan Culwell  11:01  
I feel like that's true. In one hand, it's like because I'm doing that I'm like, I'm focused on what I'm doing. And I want to make another record. I'm looking around for the cash right now. let's let's let's do it. You got one in the bag. Let's make another one. But on the other hand, is cheaper than ever to make a record? You right? You do it right here. We could just set up right here when they're closed. And they make record probably do it with this little machine you got? I would assume, throw that on a laptop. We're good to go. Yeah. You know, so it's it. That's true. But it's also we're all bullshitting ourselves a little bit. You know,

Thomas Mooney  11:36  
right. Well, I there's something though, where maybe, and this is people cared about records back then. But like, there was less of a focus on you making a some kind of dramatic record. And it was like, you know, where Dolly Parton gets three records out in a year. And like Johnny Cash is putting two records out every year,

Ryan Culwell  12:00  
I guess, getting them out there and getting attention arms a little different than you can make them. Nobody gives a crap because there's so much going on.

Thomas Mooney  12:07  
Yeah, well, and that goes to that whole thing where maybe. Now granted, there was, you know, concept records back then. And there's records that, that roll together and all that kind of stuff. But you know, in a way where it's more like, Hey, here's the next batch of songs. There's more of that going on. You know, what, even like Willie Nelson is doing that kind of stuff, even though we all kind of think of him as being more of a prolific songwriter. He's still cutting a whole bunch of other people's stuff. How many records? Is it? Is it 140? I can remember the the Texas Monthly ranking list, but it's great. It's a ridiculous amount of records. I'd like to do that man. Yeah.

Ryan Culwell  12:54  
Yeah, it's almost like the easier it is to make a record, the harder is to get attention on it. Get any years on it, but I make the magic records. I mean, I don't do it on purpose that it always just, hey, these are obvious. We stick together. So right, try to figure out what I'm talking about.

Thomas Mooney  13:14  
Why remember that the one of the first times we talked was around when you're putting out flatlands. And obviously, like I gravitated towards that record, because it just felt like this was home. And you were saying you're saying it in a way that felt refreshing but familiar. And I think a lot of people resonated with that record. But I remember you talking about how, like that record could have been easily just 10 other songs that felt that were about home about flatlands. They could have been called flatlands. But were 10 different songs. Yeah. Do you ever think about like going back in man, or what's the I

Ryan Culwell  13:55  
hear I'm like, sometimes a melody will pop into my head. And I'll be, you know, walking through the house singing it. My wife will be like, Oh my gosh, I haven't heard that forever. she'll start singing it. And then my kids will be like, well, we don't know what this is. And we'll just try to remember it. And there they are. But usually the ones that get cut, there's a reason, you know. I mean, in some of them, there's still hold overs there. There's a record that I've got a record coming out like early next year, that there's a song on it that almost went on flatlands, but I just kind of knocked the bucket over when we were filling it up. And so we just, I just had to try again. And I feel like we nailed it this time, but it just wasn't wasn't ripe yet. I didn't change anything about it. It's just I changed a little bit and laid back a little bit. So there it is. So yeah, I guess I am kind of going back but most of it is gone. Yeah, you know, there's a whole I mean, I have 140 Records too. You just never hear them and they're not very good, most likely. Yeah, I don't want to rank them on I'll get Texas Monthly on the show. Christian Wallace. This is the best part about the boom. Yeah.

Thomas Mooney  15:12  
But I don't know I find it fascinating how you and obviously plenty of artists expand and change. But like the difference between flatlands feeling like a very dry, flat place the panhandle and then the next album really feeling like this, like Sonic, sonically rich kind of. Yeah, I always compare to, like the war on drugs. But like a country record or Yeah, any rock Americana thing? What's the question? Well, the question is, like, just like, how, why, Yeah, why? How did you like expand towards that way,

Ryan Culwell  15:51  
a lot of that's just relationships and what different people pull out of you, you know, what they, what they pull, you know, what they decide not to put in a song or to help you edit out sonically or to add to it, and just the different way people envision you. And so, I've been fortunate enough that the producers that I've been working with that I trust them. And you know, they'll take me down a road, and I'll go for it. But I, you know, part of that last record, I was kicking and screaming half the way and then settled into it, you know, there were moments where I was like, What the hell are we doing? Like, you know, and then we figure it out and be like, Oh, this is this is it? This feels great. You know, I think relationships, energy, you know, sometimes you got a little shaken up, and sometimes you just call. Yeah. And so over the last decade, I've experienced several of me, you know, it feels like and there they are. I was I listened to flatlands A while ago, because I haven't listened to it and probably, I don't know, several years. All the way through like that. And I was driving from Amarillo to Lubbock. Like Yeah, listen to it. And, you know, and I was thinking the same thing like, Wow, what a jump like, then I was thinking about won't come home. And it's like, well, same thing between records. I don't know that I can go back and become the kid that same flatlands either, you know, right. I don't know if anybody's listening, they probably don't understand what reference I just made. But in the song One come home, it's basically like, once you once you leave, you can't come back. Once you make the last American you can't make flour once again, right? You know, and that's fine. But

Thomas Mooney  17:39  
no, I I'm right there with you. I always love artists who they sound like when I was 25. They sound like when I was 25. And then they sound like 30 when I'm 30. Yeah, and just the progress. You may not always love the direction it is. I know like a lot of people the easiest example is like with Sergio Simpson right as far as like people just either love it or hate it. And so we were there and okay with the ride all the way through. And some people are like, let me off here.

Ryan Culwell  18:08  
Yeah, I think maybe sometime it's good to shake off those hangers on just like, get somebody new on your back. Because if you're not digging it, then just I liked it. Like I trust artists. You know, I don't like many artists, but when I do, I'm like I'm in take me on a ride. I might not like the view from this one in the beginning. But I'll learn you know, like, for me, I think we've talked about this in the past. So it's like, all my favorite music is music I used to hate not talk a lot of shit. So if I'm talking shit on you, I'll probably love you in six months. I'll be I'll be talking you up but but the most drastic example is drive by truckers. First time somebody put that on, I was like, This is the worst shit that's ever been made. Like, this is how many guitar solos he got. Let's I mean, why is the tone so Traci? Yeah. And now, you know, really influential on not just the way I play music, but the way I think about things.

Thomas Mooney  19:03  
Yeah, I think like, what's what I guess like one of those things that I think all artists kind of want to tap into is this like universalism? Like you want to like kind of reach fans, right? Yeah, but but I think like, this is where I'm going with with is going going? being like really regional. Yeah. You know, and I think like there's people were making regional records about where they're from since the beginning. But now like with Americana, I think like South Eastern gave an allowance for a lot of people to be okay with where they're from. Yeah, that's good.

Ryan Culwell  19:45  
I was talking about I was talking to cephalic. Today, I was at his house in Amarillo and we were talking about doing regional stuff, you know, not caving to that. thing that makes you want to think you're going to get a little further By homogenising A little bit, yeah, you know, I don't think about it too much. Just do what I do, but I'm aware of it. You know, right. I see it going on, and everybody wants to be a real big deal. It's like you don't be a real big deal. You want to be part of a community, you know, and that'll fly a little bit if you do it.

Thomas Mooney  20:19  
Yeah. Wait, there's something to the whole. I guess. Like, I wonder like, what someone like I know a lot like Turnpike, very much romanticized Oklahoma. And I know, like, they would never feel the pressure to like, continue trying to make that same record. But like, when you have that, and I hate to, like, use the term like, one hit wonder, but like an artist like that, who had have really big commercial success with that specific sound that specific like, hey, I need to like, am I? Are you being like, held to that standard, that same standard? You know what I mean?

Ryan Culwell  21:00  
Or do you not really standard, but like the same form? Yeah. Right. For Yeah, there you go. It's got to be difficult. Fortunately, for me, I've never been just a huge success. So I do whatever they want. And there was a lot of pressure, like internally from it, because I had so much critical success, you know, I didn't play to 1000s of people. But I was written up in every corner of the earth, you know, with flatlines. And in the last American, both done well, but that that first kind of flash, a light that I'd never seen before is blinding me a little bit like, whoo, shit. I guess I'm supposed to do this again. I can't I can't do that. I don't know how I did it the first time, right. Those were songs I didn't think anybody would hear. And so to contrive some sort of thing to try to do that, again, would be hilarious.

Thomas Mooney  21:50  
You know, right. Well, I mean, it's, it goes to, I'm sure like, there's you mentioned, just having like, even songs that that they weren't right for the time. Maybe they've died off, but like that one's on you. You mentioned earlier about on this next record, still hanging around. You've had like a bunch of these songs probably for a long time. Yeah. Did you? Did you with flatlands? I guess like it kind of formed together in this way where it felt like okay, this is what I want to talk about. I know you've had music before there before flatlands. But as far as an introduction for people, it really was, yeah, that was that was it? And then it feels like you had to not necessarily had to but you know, got to like swerve a little right? To get out from under myself. Yeah, maybe like maybe. I don't know how much I was

Ryan Culwell  22:52  
aware of intentional what was happening inside of me, but I definitely I bucked the system if I can. And it's not intentional. It's just what I do. I'm just kind of always been that way. So as soon as somebody liked it, I was like, That's terrible. You know? We're not proud of it. I'm just joking. But yeah, there was a little swerve in there. But you know, but a lot of it was just natural, because of the people I was hanging around. And what they could hear in the songs and, you know, new batch songs, gets a new palette, and here you go, you know?

Thomas Mooney  23:27  
Yeah. Well, I think like, going with the last American, I think there's a lot of staying power. In that record. I hope so. That, like, that's like 18 to 2018 Yeah, it feels like and this is maybe like human nature as far as like, picking out patterns are really good at that as far as like, picking up patterns and then applying it to what's happening right now in your life. I think like, in a weird way, like, that record tapped into something that was that's been happening the last year as far as like, I'm not gonna

Ryan Culwell  24:00  
lie, I was ahead of the game. Whoa, I mean, I didn't know what was gonna happen by any means. But I felt something and went for it. And you know, I when I think about the songs now I'm like, Oh my god, they just, they feel like shit if I'd put up if I'd put that out today, instead of then might just explode you know, where people would be like, how dare you probably get canceled for something.

Thomas Mooney  24:31  
Well, I don't know. Like there's it's it's strangely been like a like a quarantine record. For me, maybe just for you. I don't I don't know. Like that's what i'm talking. I don't know. I maybe Maybe someone's gonna say now. My my buddy Jeff Dennis will say absolutely.

Ryan Culwell  24:46  
Yeah. Well, that's. I really appreciate that. I'm proud of it. I feel like those songs. Here's the thing is I think you're right. But I wish it wasn't true. I wish the songs were worthless and we didn't have to think about right. All these things. Yeah, but, but they're not in this world we're in. And so we got, we got a lot to think about. Yeah. Well, I

Thomas Mooney  25:08  
mean, you're still like a lot of those songs still are in relation to your kids. Yeah, there's

Ryan Culwell  25:13  
so much that's, that's like, exploring that concept through my own life. Right. It's not all literal by any means. But yeah. Yeah. It's not like I'm like, here's my predictions for the end of the world. Yeah. That's the next record.

Thomas Mooney  25:32  
Yeah, well, I mean, like, what's, what's going on? Now? Like you've mentioned, the new record is going to be coming early next year? Yeah, I know you. I don't know if you've just been texting back and forth. But what what's been like the, I guess, like the past year, as far as what you've been working on, like, what's what's been the

Ryan Culwell  25:54  
well, I did that thing with our resellers, we decided to cover had like a hole from Nine Inch Nails, which,

you know, people either love or they're like, EFF you, buddy. And I'm like, guy, No,

man, I get it. I hate myself too. Like, you're not telling me anything new. You shouldn't touch a song like that. But we did. And it's good. So kiss my ass. And here we go. So we did that. I don't know how that happened. It just happened remotely. We just recorded it with the with the interwebs and stuff. And then, um, then had a bunch of songs that were just making sense together. And I called Nielsen who produced flatlands. And I was like, I told him, I want to make a country record that sounds like ZZ Top. And he said, I got you. And then we went in to do what we did. It. I mean, it obviously doesn't sound like ZZ Top. But that was the He's like, we talked about Neil Young, and we talked about ZZ Top. And I, you know, and so we did that. And that's, you know, we're working now we're just wrapping up artwork and doing that whole thing. And I think we're hopefully going to drop a single in September. That's the plan. And then keep making Keep, keep more videos, more, more pictures, my ugly face all over wherever we can put it. Try to get people to listen to it, but I'm excited about it. I think it might. I'm in the fortunate position to these, this record and the two before it. I feel like they're all my best record I've ever made. So, you know, if you ask me the best record ever made all three of them. This one's the best record, right? Yeah, but I wouldn't talk to the other two either, man. I'm

Thomas Mooney  27:38  
pretty happy. This episode of new slang is brought to you by the blue light live here in Lubbock, Texas. Blue Light has long been the heart and soul of the Lubbock singer songwriter scene, and has been a home away from home for some a Texas Americana, country and rock and roll's finest over the years. Talk with 99.9% of the Songwriters who have come out of Lubbock in the panhandle at large over the past 20 years. And they'll point to just how integral and necessary the blue light is, with live music and touring slowly but surely coming back spots like the blue light or getting back to their usual ways as well. That means music every night of the week. Do you want to see that schedule? Well, I've got a few options for you. One, go to their socials and give them a follow up that is at blue light live on Twitter, at the blue light live on Instagram. And of course by just searching the blue light live on Facebook. They're consistently posting that week's lineup of shows as well as those heavy hitters that ought to be on your calendar that are coming up on the horizon. To check out blue light lubbock.com as well. There they have the full schedule, the cover charges time, any of those specials that may be happening while they're go check out their merge page. They have a wide range of hats, koozies, hoodies, sweaters, beanies, jackets, and so much more. You can of course get all of your merchant age, when you go see your favorite band, take the stage at blue light, just ask the bartender and they will get you all set. Speaking of which, that's another great way of seeing who's playing there. Just go to the blue light. It's at 1806 Buddy Holly Avenue here in Lubbock, Texas. And of course, again that is blue light, loving calm. I'll throw a link into the show notes to maybe I'll see you there. Okay, let's get back to the show.

The song you did with Aubrey? I thought like there for a second. We're gonna get season four True Detective. I mean, it feels like

Ryan Culwell  29:50  
Yeah, come on. Somebody put that on. I don't know how Yeah, how that works with a cover. I'm sure Trent Reznor would be like no, maybe he maybe he likes Money doesn't sound like it but

Thomas Mooney  30:04  
yeah, I always like go back to with Nine Inch Nails as far as like well I mean, you okay, I was just mid mid thought with two different thoughts. Clearly you have to get because Trent Reznor and Atticus Ross do so many so many soundtracks now for movies, clearly you have to work it into something he's working on for a movie. You know what I'm saying? As far as getting your cover?

Ryan Culwell  30:31  
I should aim and that's what he's already doing slide in there, whatever he's Yeah, that's the route. That's, that's good way to think about it. Yeah. The other thing to think till you're here the other day, and so maybe they'll figure it out. You know, get me on some TV. It'd be nice. Yeah, you know,

Thomas Mooney  30:49  
we're gonna get you on Yellowstone.

Ryan Culwell  30:50  
It legitimize me to you know, my people actually know, you know, people you know, are always impressive. They see you on TV. Right? It doesn't matter if it's the news or detector.

Thomas Mooney  31:02  
Well, is it? Is that the going back to being getting all the critical acclaim with flatlands in the Rolling Stones at all? Is that where like you heard from people? Yeah. Am I going Oh, man, like,

Ryan Culwell  31:16  
I think for some people, there's a temptation to to laugh or shrug that off a little bit. I'm like, Nah, embrace it. It's good, man. I just, I just wanted to make good just hometown kid makes good. That's all I wanted. Yeah. So I think I made some people proud. It feels good.

Thomas Mooney  31:34  
You What was it the other day? The the local paper? Was it in the Amarillo paper? Like you had like it was covering the single. Was it like in

Ryan Culwell  31:43  
Oh, yeah, they the the woman that did the artwork. Yeah, they put her on, you know, channel for her and Amarillo. And they talked about the artwork. And I was just I thought it was really cool. Because she's an art teacher, you know, I'm not out there trying to shake it and get all the attention. She's She's just working hard. And she loves the art. And so she's she did this. She's actually from parrington. She lives in tomorrow, but we didn't know each other in periods. And you know, I just thought that was coolest thing in the world. And I'm gonna go be on channel for tomorrow. You know, what's better than that?

Thomas Mooney  32:17  
Yeah. What's the what's the periods and local paper? What's the name?

Ryan Culwell  32:23  
Don't ask me that. Because they've been in there and they've been kind of gracious to me. And the ockel tree periods. And I don't know we just call it the periods and paper. It's got a name.

Thomas Mooney  32:33  
I don't know if it had like a weird name. I don't know. Because fort Stockton it's the fort Stockton pioneer. The what fort Stockton pioneer.

Ryan Culwell  32:41  
The fort? No, it's nothing like that. It's either like the Oracle tree journal or the Peyton Gazette or you know something very,

Thomas Mooney  32:49  
yeah. accessible. Yeah. Well, you know, pioneer that's pretty great. The pioneers got them all be Yeah, the there's, there's still always one of those things where I always kind of romance. romanticize the idea of like, moving back to Fort Stockton and taking over the pioneer and just like reporting on and just giving up all this shit because it's not working. But like going back and just covering. You know, I don't give up that idea. That's pretty awesome. Actually. Are all got drunk again? Good way to go in debt by newspaper. Well, I think why do you got to buy it? You know, just do it. Run it into the ground. The squeakiest

Ryan Culwell  33:31  
wheel I've ever heard back there. Yeah. That's funny. I was thinking Ford stock and I was listening to you and Christian Wallace. Talk about ice skating.

in Odessa. I just laughed so hard. What it's like, yeah, I'm picturing you as adults. Like, yeah, sort of mandate.

Thomas Mooney  34:02  
Yeah, that's it. That's always the weirdest thing, right? Thinking about the people you know, as adults as like when they're telling like you're just a smaller Thomas Mooney. Yeah, you're just like, had the beard all that kind of stuff? Yeah. Even at eight 910. All that kind of stuff. Oh, yeah. I don't know why it's such a weird like, why there was the what their what their, I guess, reasoning on on building the ice skating rink. Other than maybe like, prime money, give the youth a place to get off the streets. So they're not out there doing drugs can't

Ryan Culwell  34:38  
have those skateboard parks in our town. Let's get an ice skating rink. When I lived in Michigan, for I came down here. Maybe that's the story. Maybe

Thomas Mooney  34:48  
not one of my favorite stories about Music City Mall, which is that's the mall in Odessa. And this is like it sounds urban legend and it sounds so ridiculous that it must be true. And that is They had done the study that like more people stay in malls longer if it's carpeted, so that's why like the mall in Odessa is a carpeted mall rose. Yeah. Why do people stay in malls longer? If they're carpet? I have no idea. That's just what I've heard. Maybe their feet don't hurt as bad. So they're just comfortable. The power walkers.

Ryan Culwell  35:22  
Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's a weird. I hate carpet. I think that's universal. I think that's universal. Sure. Nobody likes carpet, especially in a mall. I was saying the last time I talked to you. It was a weird conversation on the phone. And what I didn't realize and you might not have thought so but I got off. Oh, and then we were on clubhouse before that. And I was kind of aloof on clubhouse. just rambling and some some old guy with a mustache who has a cool mustache. So they're trying to ask me about my music. And I was like, I don't know, man. But just my official apology to that guy. Totally didn't know I had COVID. And I was going down that too. Yeah, at the time I went home, I jumped on the phone with my brother on the phone for like, like the, you know, probably an hour after I talked to you. I was like, I sat in the car and talk to my brother for a little bit. And I was like, Oh, crap, I don't know if I'm gonna be able to get in the house. It just happened. Like, boom. So it's my apology for my strange behavior on that day, if there was any.

Thomas Mooney  36:30  
I didn't I didn't send Sydney. But the COVID the COVID brain the COVID like rapid, rapid decline. Yeah, it is real. I know. Charlie stout still talks about having COVID brain. You know, now the fog.

Ryan Culwell  36:45  
I think I still got a touch. You know? Yeah, I've been touched for most of my life. So. I mean, I worry. I'm like, Am I gonna remember lyrics? Well, no, I'm not sure where I'm at some days. Do you worry about like, remembering lyrics wanting to until I'm saying and then I don't think about anything. But I yeah, I fret over all this stuff. You know?

Thomas Mooney  37:04  
Yeah. I always, people always ask, are they, they, when they get off stage after they played a show? You almost always ask someone that, you know, how did it sound? Yeah. And that person always like, Oh, it's phenomenal. It was great. They didn't? Because they don't know. All the if there was like a minor hiccup or if there was even a major fuckup like you don't really ever nobody sees those.

Ryan Culwell  37:25  
Notice it? Yeah. It's vanity to think that somebody is looking at that. I mean,

we're trying to get the big picture, you know, nobody's looking at the brushstrokes. Those are for later times, you go back. And if you've already seen the big picture, and then you notice the messed up brushstroke, brush, brush stroke, then maybe that's even cooler than it doesn't make it bad. You go How does the big picture so beautiful if the brush strokes sucks, right? And that's maybe the way I'm doing? I'm just making stuff up. I think that I think there's probably some to that. You know, and then most people are just like, they're not. They're off familiar with that specific skill set. enough to worry about it. Just do I feel good? Does that feel good. And it also takes place like sometimes you fret like in the studio or whatever, over the smallest thing, the you know, nobody's going to notice. But you know, they're going to feel different when they hear it. So you might not ever be able to go, you don't know what you're missing, first of all, so if we EQ something a certain way, you don't know that you missed that mid range being not scooped or scoop or whatever. Unless you're just really dialed in to that kind of thing. You got to be a freak show. But you know how you react, you know? Like there's not a lot of high end on flatlands. It's not a real sparkly six, right, you know, and if it was I'd be a totally different record to me emotionally. You know, and there's times I wanted it to be glossed over should be real glossy. Listen to it. I'm like nah, sound dirty like this. It's great.

Thomas Mooney  39:03  
I want to break one more time to talk about our pals over at Desert door and offer up a quick Thomas Mooney, cocktail minute, as I've said probably 100 times by now, by no means am I a seasoned mixologist or bartender, but these have been some of my desert door go twos. For starters, let's just go with the tried and true range water. pop the top off the topo Chico. Take a good swig. Now pour in some desert door and top it off by throwing in a few lime wedges never fails. This one. It's so simple. It probably doesn't even count. But again, pretty foolproof. do the exact same thing but get you a Mexican Coca Cola. I guess you can go with a regular one. But you're really cutting yourself short if you don't opt for the Mexican import variety. All right, here's the change up you've been waiting for. Desert door sangria. This one is probably For when you have company coming over and you aren't wanting to just be over there making six different drinks at a time, what you'll need is some desert door. Obviously, a bottle of red wine, honey, boiling water, apple cider, apple cider vinegar, some cinnamon sticks, a couple of apples in some time springs. I know that may sound intimidating, but trust me, it's worth the prep. And honestly, it's pretty easy. For starters, get you a Punchbowl, add that honey, those cinnamon sticks and the boiling water together. Now you're going to want to stir that all up and let it cool down for about an hour. So remember, patience is a virtue. Once that's done, add some desert door and stir vigorously. Now add the one the cider and the vinegar and continue stirring until it's equally mixed. Now slice those apples up and toss them in. Put in those time sprigs as well. Now you can pour that over some ice and you have a modified sangria chef's kiss. Anyway, those have been some of my favorite go twos as of late. And remember desert door is as versatile as vodka and more refined, smooth, complex and intriguing than tequila. It's rich and balanced. And whether you decide to keep it simple or want to experiment desert door is that perfect Texas spirit there's plenty more recipes over at Desert door.com as well check out the show notes for a link all right let's get back to the episode

you see it a lot of times with with young songwriters especially like during songwriter night up here on Mondays or like during the competition, the lowering of expectations. And that's the other songs brand new guys don't Oh,

yeah. Never do that. Yeah. And I just I'm just no one is going to know

Ryan Culwell  41:59  
you could do the best job in the world because you said that everybody's looking for the brushstroke now and I'm where does it suck? I'm gonna change that. It's not done yet. Is it here? You know, you there's always a guy in the crowd is like, I got an idea. That one song maybe if you just flipped this like, okay, you know, I'll come out and tell you how to build fence next week. You tell me how to write a song. Yeah, that's inevitable. That's just part of life. It's kind of fun. Once you embrace that. Yeah,

Thomas Mooney  42:29  
think about it. I love going on Twitter. And anytime Jason is will tweet something that's a song within like five replies. Yeah. It's there. in taxes, and someone telling Jason is well, there's a song in there.

Ryan Culwell  42:46  
Yeah. Yeah, it's constant. But it's got you know, that's okay. That's the rhythm we've got.

Thomas Mooney  42:52  
No, I love it. Like, I think it's so funny. Like, it's the but we only have like, a handful of stories that you've heard that are like genuine. Someone told me there was a song in there. There's probably a shit ton more that we like I that people don't want to like, yeah, I'm sure it's just

Ryan Culwell  43:14  
okay. And it's, you know, a lot of times if somebody grew up with or something, you know, just like you love them, but you're like, That's hilarious.

Thomas Mooney  43:20  
Yeah. Yeah, the I forgot what was gonna say we're gonna Oh, I know what I was gonna circle back to you. And that's clubhouse. It's funny. Like how like clubhouse just I don't know if anyone's going on clubhouse anymore. Are you done? I think I think I'm pretty quick. Yeah. I think on my worst self on clubhouse. I just feel like sometimes I yeah. You know, it's such a like, what's funny about clubhouse is like it came at the tail end of the quarantine. Yeah. Good. Perfect. Right in the middle of it. Right. You know, you think so? But maybe like, maybe that was like, a good thing that it didn't come? Yeah, we'd

Ryan Culwell  44:02  
all just been screaming. Yeah. It is just, it would have just every clubhouse would have been about mask. You know, it's like, just let it go. Yeah,

Thomas Mooney  44:11  
that's the one thing I will say that it's probably a contributing factor of me just not getting on clubhouse anymore. And I think for a lot of people is that like, all the conversations ended up at that point of, you're gonna get a vaccine, you're gonna get the mask on like, you're gonna like, it just went all like everything went back to that point. And I thought like one of the beauties of clubhouse was that it fast tracked a lot of relationships. Yeah, between people where you just kind of you didn't have to.

Ryan Culwell  44:43  
I was in rooms instantly with people like I definitely need to know this person. And I think they would enjoy what I do. And that could be lead to something good, but yeah, I just made all that stuff happen instantly. I didn't make good on any of it, but I saw the potential for it.

Thomas Mooney  44:58  
right for me. Like just knowing more people in the industry that I had emailed back and forth or and lock it in putting a voice to it made it like we're like, oh, okay, these things actually turn now. Where? Because they know my voice they know I'm a real person. Things got done a few things, you know what I mean? But

Ryan Culwell  45:20  
I claiming it's getting on it because that guy on the the icon for the app looks like a dipstick. So I was like, I'm done with this guy.

Thomas Mooney  45:29  
You know, it's trying to think of who that is. Now, there's some Oh, they changed it. Yeah, it's a woman. Right there. You see.

Ryan Culwell  45:36  
Oh, how old is she now? Because that picture was obviously taken seven years ago.

Thomas Mooney  45:42  
I have no idea. I did one time. Make the icon, Charlie stout. It was like Jay Charlie, they switched. Just

Ryan Culwell  45:52  
like I become so infamous around here. What's this do? Oh, I don't know. Hi, songwriter. He interviewed me next door at Toms. Cow Lee 2006 or something? Really? Yeah. I don't find that interview, please. I'm sure it's terrible. But he just been here. He just keeps being here. Well, he's in Tucson now. Well, that's stupid. Yeah, Charlie. That just made me look dumb. First of all, was he doing in two songs taking pictures of that same cactus every day? Yeah, I think he's like, inside baseball if you're new to the podcast,

Thomas Mooney  46:35  
setting up a new little studio to record some music, I guess. I don't know. And then it's one of those like, oh, man, he moved to Tucson. And he'd been out in Tucson before he moved to Lubbock. But it's like maybe moving to Tucson in the middle of summer. He's his songs are like Charlie's never gonna be like the dad who like talks about weather. You know, and that man, like the weather's been out bad today. But like, there's been a handful of texts about, man, it's like 90 degrees. And it's 8am. Well,

Ryan Culwell  47:06  
yeah, that kind of shit is he seems like he's comfortable being uncomfortable, though. Yeah. goes into churches full of rattlesnakes or something to record records. I assume there's rattlesnakes in there? I don't know. Yeah, that'd be some. Yeah, I like that's what I like about this whole scene, though, is even though he's gone, there's just a lot of people that have been around for a lot. A lot of years. They just keep adding into it building thing. And then now there's a thing. It's a real thing. And it's birth. Not just careers, but a sound. You know, a movement sorts. You see, you know, flatland and all that stuff. Now is kind of the biggest kind of banner for that.

Thomas Mooney  47:49  
Yeah. Well, that's the this was this was not something that Jimmy Dale Gilmore had said during our interview, but I have read about like him talk about a lot of people put a lot of emphasis and you know, Lubbock or West Texas, the panhandle being a special place for music, and him kind of being like, this happens everywhere. It's just like saying, talking about it that I think that makes it an event. If you treat it like that. I think that's a

Ryan Culwell  48:21  
real thing. If there's a you in every town, that's really helpful, you know, or every every region. And there's there's not a you in every region, but it's it's happening more and more, you know, obviously with the way the internet podcasts are calling, but you've added you've contributed a lot. And a lot of it's just it's it's like going to the bar and you walk in and you're like Who the hell's on stage, whatever. It Like, say Me, me and you walk into the bar, somebody is on stage, and you're like, Who's that? And I'm like, Who gives a shit? Then that's the tone. Or if we walk into the bar, and you say, who's that? I'm like, I don't know, do you? Let's find out sounds good. You know, or whatever. We raise that. Just like, I don't know, let's see how good see if he has, then all of a sudden, that opens up a thing or if you've heard of him before? Yeah, oh, you're gonna love this song. They're all sudden you listen from a different angle the whole night, the whole night's change, and that bleeds to the next person, the next person, but just like a little bit of not just positivity. Positive positivity is nice word by the way. positivity. But expectation. Yeah, you know, raising the opposite of that kid going Oh, no, I read this last night. I remember the words you've got a cough, but like hey, you know really flexing a little bit it's not bad thing.

Thomas Mooney  49:39  
Yeah, I think there's something too. And I brought that up to Jimmy as far as the the idea of even now like your base in a lot of regions, a lot of going back to original music, a lot of cities, a lot of pockets. Basing what they're doing on the history. You have what others did. Right. And that like that all builds up. Yeah. You know, it becomes a story. Yeah. And I think that's what more than anything else is what made love it cool.

Ryan Culwell  50:10  
Yeah, we're like made West Texas draw through line, you know, go from one guy to the next to the next to the next you know. And there's voices you can hear there's a there's a What's his kid's name? look him up. Hurst said his name, Arapaho. Do you know about this? I don't think so. I don't know. I don't know, somebody sent me the song from this kid. And I assume these from around here, because he sound like not saying he sounded just like so. And so but he had that tinge that he goes back he goes back for 20 years I've heard that sound, every single band it's there's a voice inflection that it's completely luck. You know? And, and that that which is bled out further and further through Texas, and you can hear Parker McCollum, and by God, hold me to it. He sounds like he wants to be from Lubbock. You know, that's, that's what I hear from a distance, because I'm not not too familiar with the whole scene. But I listened to a guy I'm like, Oh, you sound like the guy that listened to pat green and then went to his bedroom, and then went to the blue light. And then on and on. And on. Right

Thomas Mooney  51:18  
goes. Yeah, I think there's something also too, even in that. It's not just necessarily necessarily the what you write or how you write what you're writing about. It's in the voice, that dryness. Like someone like john Bauman, who, for all intents and purposes, grew up in San Antonio, even though he's born in Amarillo. I've never heard like a more West Texas voice. Like,

Ryan Culwell  51:49  
I was listening to your podcast here while back y'all were talking about like, you know, we me and you talked a long time ago about culture and about like, being isolated from, you know, because we'd already when flatlands came out everybody's like, oh, but you listen to Joey Lee every day of your life. And I'm like, I think I know once a while maybe. And then I listened to him. And I'm like, Well, I do sound like this. I do. I am in this lineage. I just by proximity of like by the dirt in the air. I mean, you kind of can't help it sound like that. But But then I feel like I'm misrepresented because at the time I told you like, what everything way up there in parrington. Two hours north of Amarillo, right, you're just in the middle of nowhere, was just imported for on MTV, whatever is coming on your box, you know, but then that was a lie, too. Because I've used that a whole bunch though. Like it's there's something there. There's something there's a reality to it. I've heard you kind of mentioned it and but then I heard john go like, like, why would you want to grow up? I'm like, well, you gotta take that in context. Also knew the strangest weirdest things ever. My brother would come in, have a record on, you know, that nobody had ever heard. And he's just jamming and you know, he's driving his truck around. I'm trying to even think of a reference here. But my dad started throwing john Lee Hooker records at me early, you know? And then the guys that led him to being him and throwing that out there. I'm defending my, my 16 year old self to go No, no, no, I know more than what's on the TV. Yeah. Miley weirdin insecurity I have. What does? I think that's a cool thing, though, is like what influenced you that weird thing I heard my uncle say, that weird record he had my dad had, which is not necessarily you know, I always feel like this. People are like, very familiar with this inside of this scene, or this or that. I'm like, Oh, no, man, like, the girl at Walmart sounded weird. That was influential, you know, or like, your babysitter said, the same phrase every day. And it wound up in a song You know, you don't know. Right? Just these very, like, micro scenes of rambling here. But, you know, you know what I'm saying? Yeah,

Thomas Mooney  53:57  
yeah. It's the one point your parents were like diehard, just fanatics about some artists that was not big. Yeah. And that was that carried on with them, no matter how old they got. They loved so and so. They love like, you know, it's easy touchdown for Elvis, but like the the lesser known Elvis. That person was right.

Ryan Culwell  54:27  
My dad always thought Foster and Lloyd was just the coolest thing in the world. You know, the cool thing is when he came to see me in Nashville, the first time they were playing a free show down the street. It's like, let's go. Yeah, walked around the corner. He's like, Oh, my God, you know? Yeah. Stuff like that. I mean, that's a pretty big band, but also not a pretty big band.

Thomas Mooney  54:43  
Right? Yeah. And I guess that's my point is like, there's always going to be that in decred that you didn't know that you're paying for that. Cool. Yeah. And then mixed in with all the top 40 stuff. What's and like our top 40 as you mentioned, was the TVs, the VH ones. Yeah. 90s Country radio, but in a lot of ways, it's the same thing that was happening for your grandparents. Whenever, like you could catch radio from Mexico in Chicago, but it was just a different thing that was still gonna be like top that was still like that top layer. Yeah. Even though like the the stuff for Mexico, they were playing a lot of blues and a lot of like, you know, minority type of records as far as like African Americans and Spanish and Oh, you know what I mean? But but I think it's still kind of the same thing.

Ryan Culwell  55:34  
Yeah. But dialing into the same thing all over the world. That's cool. Yeah.

Thomas Mooney  55:40  
I'm gonna get you out here on this. And this is about, you know, you moved up to Nashville. And somehow, like, you still run into like, people from West Texas, somehow, all the time, right? Yeah.

Ryan Culwell  55:52  
Blood, the show where I got COVID, which I swear, that's where I got it. That entire half the bar was from Lubbock, literally, and Ross Cooper was playing. And we, you know, we were being discreet, because everybody was shaming everybody for trying to make a living and play music. But go ahead. Yeah.

Thomas Mooney  56:13  
Oh, no, it's the is do you feel like you've gravitated towards people who are from the same place, even though you're from far away? Or is that just still one of those things? Where, oh, I've just not, I don't, I don't talk about all these other people who are from Nashville, or like, from Tennessee, or Arkansas, or wherever, in your day to day life that you mean, just logistically for daughters.

Ryan Culwell  56:38  
I just don't have time. I'm like your dad getting off work. And it's tired. You know, except for my, my job is to try to encourage little girls, you know, you can do it. You're amazing. Yeah. So you know, especially as last year, not a lot of hanging. But I made a few really tight relationships. I'm not was the question whether I gravitate to people from West Texas while I'm there? Probably not. I'm definitely into new experiences, but trying to stretch myself. And that said, I miss this place a lot. You know, this place being hundreds of miles. I missed the people here. People here make a lot of sense to me. And ripe to come home at some point. Just cannot figure that out yet. And now listen to my own record driving down here and listen, if you leave, you won't come home. Dammit if I wouldn't, right,

Thomas Mooney  57:48  
right. Yeah, that makes sense. No, it does. I mean, it makes a lot of sense. Because even if you in that song you talked about even if you do you're not gonna be the same person so much. It's It's weird. Yeah, yeah. Well,

Ryan Culwell  58:11  
I really appreciate you I appreciate your time and what you've done for luck. And thank you putting the voice towards me and the writing. You've done two got a lot of journalists write about me, but a lot of them seem to miss the mark and be confused. You, you flush things out that I didn't even know were in there. I really appreciate it.

Thomas Mooney  58:30  
I appreciate it as well. I mean, one of my favorite songwriter, so thank you. Yeah, let's go get a beer. Thanks so much for coming on.

All right. That is it for this episode. Be sure to check out Ryan's catalog of songs. If you haven't checked them out just yet. Be sure to stop on over at our presenting partners desert door and the blue light live. And yeah, I'll see y'all later this week for more episodes of new slang

Transcribed by https://otter.ai